Another bug

[Marchessa_red_witch]

avoid mobs that hate you, stealth is much higher level and has a 40mv cost - that is, as it stands, recycling costs almost nothing - no backstab happened merely the cost of walking out and back in again - which is all most always trivial. Which is why I now have a script that checks whether I want to recycle in the event of a blown dispel, and walks back out leaving me to decide how to go back in.

Presage has a chance to fail, and grip isn't as good as stab, so having the ability to recycle at a lower level makes sense.

Essentially the mob action was intended to prevent combining the first action (study or a dispel that triggered the attack) with the second - stab specifically. As it is currently implemented, it does not do that. In fact, the mob is less dangerous than if it has simply gone aggro - and while Pannalal is slow agrro, he is, in fact, aggro. Had the attack trigger simply had him swing his claw, then walking out would not have worked.

If this is the intention - that is, have people write a trigger - ok. But somehow I think not, instead, the mob action was meant to impose a cost on the character. Currently, in almost all cases, it does not.

[Medios]

So Marchessa is saying that sneak does not work against hated mobs? I would have to disagree, the rate of sneakiness might be lower but it still works afaik. Stealth is surefire, sneak is not. Bot scripts are lame, playing sloth has made my hand eye coordination go way up with the keyboard. My typing has improved greatly in the last 5 years. The only triggers I use have to do with irritating stuff like eating food, grouptells about aegis down, prot order, exiting boats, etc. Using scripts all the time would take away from my gaming experience. Its sad you guys script every command.

Mike

[Autolycos]

[quote="Medios"] [color=white:360bnibo]Using scripts all the time would take away from my gaming experience. Its sad you guys script every command.[/[/color:360bnibo]quote]


i absofuckinlutely agree..

[Marchessa_red_witch]

[quote="Medios":1wmfyf2e] Its sad you guys script every command.

Mike[/quote:1wmfyf2e]

Ok, you'll try to move silently for a while.
1-> 987/987/+43hp 339/346/+25ma 117/206/+28mv +7/+9
2-> -11.0ac 39268958xp 597821gp +10align 4:53 pm overcast Ah.Hellwell
Inside the Hut of a Madman!
Exits: West
You see Pannalal here.
1-> 987/987/+43hp 339/346/+25ma 114/206/+28mv +7/+9
2-> -11.0ac 39268958xp 597821gp +10align 4:53 pm overcast Ah.Hellwell
Ok.
You feel a spell unravel! Success!
You feel a spell unravel! Success!
Pannalal has had enough: he attacks you!
1-> 987/987/+43hp 334/346/+25ma 114/206/+28mv +7/+9
2-> -11.0ac 39268958xp 597821gp +10align 4:53 pm overcast Ah.Hellwell
You can't backstab a fighting person, too alert!
1-> 987/987/+43hp 334/346/+25ma 114/206/+28mv +7/+9
2-> -11.0ac 39268958xp 597821gp +10align 4:54 pm overcast Ah.Hellwell
Outside a Small Hut
Exits: East West Up
Standing upright in a corner is a granite tablet. [2]..It emits a faint humming sound!
1-> 987/987/+43hp 334/346/+25ma 112/206/+28mv +7/+9
2-> -11.0ac 39268958xp 597821gp +10align 4:54 pm overcast Ah.Hellwell
sneak;e;bs pan
Ok, you'll try to move silently for a while.
1-> 987/987/+43hp 344/346/+25ma 123/206/+28mv +7/+9
2-> -11.0ac 39268958xp 597821gp +10align 5:18 pm overcast Ah.Hellwell
Inside the Hut of a Madman!
Exits: West
You see Pannalal here.
1-> 987/987/+43hp 344/346/+25ma 120/206/+28mv +7/+9
2-> -11.0ac 39268958xp 597821gp +10align 5:18 pm overcast Ah.Hellwell
Pannalal hates your guts!
Pannalal makes a strange sound, as you place a thunderbolt in his back.
Pannalal makes a strange sound, as you place a thunderbolt in his back.
1-> 987/987/+43hp 344/346/+25ma 100/206/+28mv +7/+9
2-> -11.0ac 39278358xp 597821gp +10align 5:18 pm overcast Ah.Hellwell



"Attacks you means"... ummm nothing in most cases

In fact to show you how lame not hating is...

You see Pannalal here.
1-> 987/987/+43hp 365/376/+25ma 114/206/+28mv +9/+9
2-> -11.0ac 50964341xp 93280gp +10align 12:29 am overcast Ah.Hellwell
Ok.
You feel a spell unravel! Success!
You feel a spell unravel! Success!
You feel a spell unravel! Success!
You feel a spell unravel! Success!
You feel a spell unravel! Success!
You feel a spell unravel! Success!
Pannalal has had enough: he attacks you!
1-> 987/987/+43hp 361/376/+25ma 114/206/+28mv +9/+9
2-> -11.0ac 50964341xp 93280gp +10align 12:29 am overcast Ah.Hellwell
You can't backstab a fighting person, too alert!
1-> 987/987/+43hp 361/376/+25ma 114/206/+28mv +9/+9
2-> -11.0ac 50964341xp 93280gp +10align 12:29 am overcast Ah.Hellwell
Outside a Small Hut
Exits: East West Up
Standing upright in a corner is a granite tablet. [2]..It emits a faint humming sound!
1-> 987/987/+43hp 361/376/+25ma 111/206/+28mv +9/+9
2-> -11.0ac 50964341xp 93280gp +10align 12:29 am overcast Ah.Hellwell
You calm down and return to a peaceful state of mind.
1-> 987/987/+43hp 376/376/+25ma 136/206/+28mv +9/+9
2-> -11.0ac 50964341xp 93280gp +10align 1:23 am overcast Ah.Hellwell
killpan
Parry mode is now on.
1-> 987/987/+43hp 376/376/+25ma 155/206/+28mv +9/+9
2-> -11.0ac 50964341xp 93280gp +10align 2:02 am overcast Ah.Hellwell
You yell 'SANGREAL!'
1-> 987/987/+43hp 376/376/+25ma 155/206/+28mv +9/+9
2-> -11.0ac 50964341xp 93280gp +10align 2:02 am overcast Ah.Hellwell
You begin to channel your anger and enter a state of frenzy.
1-> 987/987/+43hp 376/376/+25ma 155/206/+28mv +9/+9
2-> -11.0ac 50964341xp 93280gp +10align 2:02 am overcast Ah.Hellwell
You are not using it.
1-> 987/987/+43hp 376/376/+25ma 157/206/+28mv +9/+9
2-> -11.0ac 50964341xp 93280gp +10align 2:07 am overcast Ah.Hellwell
You do not seem to have the 'thunderbolt'.
1-> 987/987/+43hp 376/376/+25ma 157/206/+28mv +9/+9
2-> -11.0ac 50964341xp 93280gp +10align 2:07 am overcast Ah.Hellwell
It's already open!
1-> 987/987/+43hp 376/376/+25ma 157/206/+28mv +9/+9
2-> -11.0ac 50964341xp 93280gp +10align 2:07 am overcast Ah.Hellwell
Ok, you'll try to move silently for a while.
1-> 987/987/+43hp 376/376/+25ma 157/206/+28mv +9/+9
2-> -11.0ac 50964341xp 93280gp +10align 2:08 am overcast Ah.Hellwell
Inside the Hut of a Madman!
Exits: West
You see Pannalal here.
1-> 987/987/+43hp 376/376/+25ma 154/206/+28mv +9/+9
2-> -11.0ac 50964341xp 93280gp +10align 2:08 am overcast Ah.Hellwell
You weave the threads of magic masterfully!
You managed to dispel the 'water breathing' spell!
You managed to dispel the 'resist cold' spell!
You managed to dispel the 'resist fire' spell!
You managed to dispel the 'regeneration' spell!
You managed to dispel the 'detect invisibility' spell!
You managed to dispel the 'armor' spell!
You managed to dispel the '' spell!
You are slapped by Pannalal.
1-> 987/987/+43hp 371/376/+25ma 154/206/+28mv +9/+9
2-> -11.0ac 50964341xp 93280gp +10align 2:08 am overcast Ah.Hellwell
Pannalal hates your guts!
You've got a good feeling about this fight...
Pannalal makes a strange sound, as you place a thunderbolt in his back.
Pannalal makes a strange sound, as you place a thunderbolt in his back.


That's right, he slaps me the second time in. The mobs are bringing an emote to a knife fight.

[Rynquald]

[quote:e4nz9o9i]Had the attack trigger simply had him swing his claw, then walking out would not have worked.
[/quote:e4nz9o9i]

Would it really matter if you had to flee instead of walk out to have the mob not hate you?

[Marchessa_red_witch]

Flee doesn't always work. This is a straight move.

Flee goes any direction, which means with few doors, a greater chance of failure, and with more, a greater chance of ending up someplace you don't want to be.

Flee has lag. Move has almost none.

Flee goes several rooms. Move goes the one room you want to go.

A mob that hated wouldn't have just slapped on the second time in.

And so on.

If the gods are happy with "had enough" being, essentially, no different from push- except if you are lagged and the trigger doesn't fire fast enough, or some exceptional circumstance of the mob - far be it from me to complain. However, the rules are if you exploit a bug, you can be wiped. I've reported the bug, had it confirmed by others, written an exploit and await further word from on high.

If they are happy with the status quo on this, so am I.

[Shazuko]

I never left the room, even when it 'had enough'...once i actually counted the seconds and got to 2-onethousand (2.5). Seems like i coulda gripped it if I wanted...just didnt because of the type of mob...I guess what you all are saying is that there is a difference between casting another spell and doing a physical attack on a mob thats 'had enough'??
On a side note, presage added to sneak/stealth can help alot...its worked for me several times on some very hateful mobs...

<Shazuko Roku Ryuu>
<Shazuko Six Dragons>
<~Chaos~>

[Mike]

March, soon enough you will find out that it is not 100% garantee that your bot trigger will work. If you cast dispel at the end of the round, mob will hit you right after you dispel him, so all you'll get is a few Its not impossible messages.
Its so good you start notice things like that after becoming tard, but spaming crier with such things is just silly. Do you really think imms dont play mortal chars and dont know about "bugs" like that? Maybe you start whine about dispel doesnt have cast lag or clearing mobs hated list?

[13]

Fleeing isn't necessary. What you need to do is type w. Then go back in after like 1/2 seconds and start the fight as you wish. No-one's guts are hated until someone gets hit. That prompt plus all this talk of scripting just confirms my already-formed opinion. You kids today rely too much on clients and shit..it's sad.

[Marchessa_red_witch]

[quote="Mike":2rfjteni]March, soon enough you will find out that it is not 100% garantee that your bot trigger will work. If you cast dispel at the end of the round, mob will hit you right after you dispel him, so all you'll get is a few Its not impossible messages.
Its so good you start notice things like that after becoming tard, but spaming crier with such things is just silly. Do you really think imms dont play mortal chars and dont know about "bugs" like that? Maybe you start whine about dispel doesnt have cast lag or clearing mobs hated list?[/quote:2rfjteni]

Sync starting you attack run with the mud. I learned that ages ago.

The trigger will fail because of net lag more than because of combat round timing.

Again, the "attacks" out come is virtually null. There are a few, a very, very, very few cases where it does mean somthing, and it will come up in odd circumstances - mostly involving lag, not game mechanics.

I've reported the behavior, others have confirmed it, I've written and tested an exploit of it. If the immorts are happy with the status quo, then that's up to them.

[Avatar]

This is all opinion, of course. This isn't a bug, it's the way the game works. If you have better ideas, there's an IDEAS command in-game. I guess that most of us would rather see more people use the in-game commands for bugs and ideas rather than posting to the crier. Again, just an opinion.

Charles

[Marchessa_red_witch]

1. it is exploitable, and is widely exploited.
2. It is a very minor, rather than major bug
3. It is easily fixable by just having the mob react in this case the way it would react to blind or other non-combat ending spells.
4. Whether the immorts want to do something about it is up to them.

I will also note that the "ideas" line is nowhere near large enough to post an example of the bug, the exploit, and proof the exploit works in the wild.

I will further note that anyone who wasn't aware of the behavior and is reading this thread now knows about it.

[alias]

If you feel its a bug why did you post it here and not just report it on bugs?

[Marchessa_red_witch]

I didn't fit in bugs and takes too long to explain.

I don't think it deserves being pkilled for either.

[13]

There's just something about Marchessa that gets under my skin.