Changes to Sloth and 2020!

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Changes to Sloth and 2020!

Postby Gorka » Sat Dec 28, 2019 11:03 am

Gorka wrote:The maths behind my claim that rebirth shop probably won't increase solo xp runs is this...

In order to get more exp in a given time frame, a player must kill a mob at least 1 round sooner than he did previously.

If my damage per round is 5 x 100 melee attacks (500), and a mob has 2500hp, I will kill it in 5 rounds.
To get xp faster I must kill the mob in 4 rounds, meaning I would need to do 625 damage in 4 rounds to get xp faster.

So basically in this case, for rebirth shop to cause players to get more xp solo, I would need 125 extra damage per round, or techincally, about +20/25 weapon damage. Rebirth shop gives +6.

However this equation doesn't work for groups... because groups will add up all the players extra damage and mobs will die faster. Grouping will be the first change we will notice and it's already the case in the game.


A number of months back I made the prediction that with all the new power ups implemented over the course of 2019, grouping would be the first change we would notice to the game. As players got more powerful the areas and mobs weren't being adjusted accordingly. This week I was in a group where nearly every single regular xp mob, died within 3 rounds this included mobs such as demogorgon. This particular group started off as 5 or 6 powerful players... we ran a 2.9b xp hour thanks to the xmas bonuses (a personal best). Eventually a lot of other players joined and the xp rate dropped... but I wanted to thank the immortal staff for a fantastically fun 2019 and also nudge the game forward a little for 2020 from my perspective.

I wanted to make some points for the immortals and area designers, because I think if there are to be any changes in 2020 to the game (even though I understand that the game has clearly peaked and is in decline), that this is the type of information that needs addressing.

GROUP AREAS
There are not many areas where a quest sized group can get xp at a faster rate than a 5-6 man group. My solution would be to clone an area like MH, and give the mobs 20% more hp's and perm sanct. The xp would need to be a little more than doubled - just so large groups have some place to go. We need more mystica / mordin type areas.

CHOP
I think Neptune solved the chopper shortage of the past with making choppers load on EU. There is still a place for chopping in sloth, in particular, chopping epics. However my metrics tend to show that any form of chopping for xp is generally at a slower rate than non-chop. (Mystica excluded) I don't get excited about Chop days. But I don't see chop issues as a pressing matter for the game at the moment. Players probably do more damage with regular attacks in most cases - offlyme... This is why chop day isn't such a big deal, unless the mob is a big deal.

AGING FORMULA
*Mob aging needs to be speed up. The mud is being wiped of mobs so much quicker with the increase in player power that after you have logged in, and wiped the floor with the mobs on your first run, you have to literally wait 2-3 hours for the mobs to be aged again. Anything you re-do within that next 2-3 hours (which you have no choice but to do really) is worth about 30% less. The aging formula was for S3, the game is moving way faster these days, and aging needs sped up. Currently nearly all solo xp mobs, are continually unaged, and it sucks.

KILL HISTORY
*You could argue that with it being easier to kill more mobs, that kill history isn't much of a handicap anymore... that's simply not true, it's exactly the same. Take CG for instance, all the moat mobs are the same template name, by the time you kill the last mob in the moat it's worth like half the xp the first one was. The idea was to try and stop players camping areas... but it was, and always will be a dumb solution because the issue is compounded by the fact that most mobs are duplicated throughout the areas by the builder... and that punishment gets passed to the player. Kill history is dumb, and always will be dumb. I also don't think area camping is currently a pressing game issue as it was in the past. I remember in s3 days people fighting over areas on gossip. I'd just get rid of it, or disable it. Keep the bonus on permanent - but that's just me. Stopping the Camping of areas is far better addressed by Age XP/Repop Times or just adding more quality areas.

XP CAPS
Caps need adjusting - The effect of lower caps is that is that it stops people like myself from running bigger mobs, even though they may now have the power to do so. This only compounds mob shortages because you get players like me, who still run shadow keep, because I won't be rewarded for running anything bigger. I would prefer to leave shadow keep for 3x40 type players, but unless my cap is raised to 20-25m you literally don't give me an advantage but to keep running the same small mobs over and over. Lyme cap also needs adjusting accordingly.

EQ
As I have lamented in an older post, now that drachma eq is almost always superior than any in game forges, there is little need to forge eq these days. New uses need to be found for old forges.

RUNES/GEMS
The only thing I lament at the moment is the fact players in my position are bound to have FAR more than they need and no use for them. Just like eq, it would be nice that gems/runes could be repurposed for other things, whether traded for drachma, or upgrades to useless eq forges.

REBIRTH SHOP
I would have quit sloth a year ago if it wasn't for rebirth shop and sticking around to see it happen. Teker did a great job, and the power increases came far more gradually and through hard work than the insane increases that were made to the 3x40 and drachma eq systems for practically free. Having already purchased everything of importance in the rebirth shop, I feel that the eq changes made me far more powerful than rebirth shop did. I can't see any reason not to raise the shop caps a fraction higher, given costs will be exponentially more. I think the 10th ma regen point for example cost over 200b xp. 1ma more per minute, 200b xp? :shock:

EPICS / HONOUR
I think the biggest current issue with this system at the moment is that the rebirths are two ranks ahead of it's implementation. More mid sized mobs with honor and raids would have been nice, and I believe that was also the intention of JB before his immortal hiatus. The clasp is nice, but it has nothing on the power of the new drachma eq... which is clearly OP.

COINS
Well this topic has got a lot of people in trouble in the past. Splork for instance has argued on several occasions that coins are not an issue in the game... and players have argued that they are. From my perspective both views are completely correct. The issue is actually GROUP COINS. Group coins are so terrible it's not funny... They come at approximately the rate of 1.5x of solo, but are split among 5-6 players in a group - meaning about 75% less coins from grouping. (This is why Taron never had coins) But the reality is, if you run solo this issue does get balanced out... and if you run solo a lot, you will be filthy rich.

MULTIPLE REBIRTHS
I don't see any reason for this at the moment. It seems the only point would be to repeat quests... so in that case, why not address the actual issue... allow the clearing of player quests for rebirths - could be an option purchasable in rebirth shop for a crap load of xp? Just a thought...

OTHER ISSUES
Msdp - would love to see msdp updated to have an OPPONENTS array that lists all of your oponents, not just the engaged one, so you can prioritise opponents.
Auto Weapon selection for backstabing - It's a god awfully hard thing to script for players as msdp doesn't update fast enough when you splork a mob or another mob engages to ensure you are using the right weapon in the right situation. If you could "set backstab weapon" and that was switched out automatically after the stab that would be magic. Believe it or not also useful also for wa / mo who may switch from barehand to sword for deathgrip. It could be more of just a Gorka/Tank frustration than a pressing issue for anyone.
Not being able to cast perception because of rebirth shop's mindbar also very frustrating. Pls fix.
As pointless as it may be at this time in life of sloth mud, if rooms could store an X,Y,Z value I could make maps for all areas with mudlet. This is something we did look at more than a year ago.

I'm also somewhat interested in becoming an immortal, but I'm nervous about the transition - whether I'd actually accomplish anything - or enjoy more being a player, even though "Gorka" is essentially "finished." I would be happy to search for ways to re-purpose old forges and find new uses for things, this will add game play which is quite finite for rebirths like myself - and now a large proportion of the game.

I've had some ideas that could help things just from a players perspective, like creating a mob database of sorts so players can find new places to run.
Gimme a G! Gimme a ORKA!
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Re: Changes to Sloth and 2020!

Postby Bandit » Sat Dec 28, 2019 11:53 pm

One thought on Avatar / Rebirth shop for potential additions:

Ability to purchase higher skill caps, but with a focus on class order to create differences between prime classes and selecting order.

Let's take thief for example. Thief prime may be able to add 5% - 8% more to key skills like backstab, double stab, circle, and excruciating blow. If you had thief in second to lets say fourth you could gain half these benefits, if you had it in 5th to 8th maybe only be able to get 1/4th the prime class benefits.

Then do the same for other classes key abilities. For spells perhaps prime classes could max some of them, since the cap is already higher at 95% for spells than it is for skills. I know there's already a mechanic to increase spell learned percentages, but it seems outdated and not something anyone pays attention to due to the requirement of teaching someone new and having few newer people around to teach to.
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