Dear Immortals

[Gandolf]

You are very retarded, I would like to thank you for ruining grouping, and screwing up areas. You guys say you want this to be a group oriented friendly mud, right? You guys could atleast warn us when your gonna screw up an area. Or tell us you dont want us to run the area... Instead of trying to prove a point and randomly making big ass mobs scan aggro all of a sudden where safe regen spots used to be safe... How fawking hard is it to do that? I mean really? You guys keep fawking up the xp runs and no one is gonna lead your bullshit Group oriented mud... Then you'll have people sitting around just chatting and making nothing out of your years of coding bullshit... Just wait and see. Maybe people can walk around and make useless conversations with your stupid ass talking mobs instead of killing them...

Thanks,
Your an idiot

[Toxis]

If you make changes in an area that's been run one billion times and don't tell the players, expect a shitstorm headed directly at you. I think you owe Rogue some exp. 66 deaths wasn't enough last week?

-Toxis

[*Splork*]

As I said online, this was me changing it. I put very little thought into it other than, this will be a fun surprise. I really should of remembered how it felt.

I apologize, the two charging flags have been removed.

Splork

[Gandolf]

I've apologized he changed it back, regardless we know about the change and I could have just announced it on here instead of blaming imms etc... Shit happens, Shit changes.. I'm not a common leader on sloth4 and I was on sloth3... I led alot on sloth 3 and it was fun, I've led twice or so on sloth4 and its harder, yes you get more rewards etc.. but that doesnt make the leading part of it any easier. I could have just gone back and killed that stupid worm that charged us instead ... Regardless its done flags removed move on... I apologized for personally attacking Splork, wasn't my intentions I was just pissed and trying to make a point and made it the wrong way... Thanks Rick for the changes you make in the mud good bad / etc... I'll probably end up leading regardless anyway, but its hard to encourage new leaders

[Toxis]

Here, let me stitch those on back between your legs, Gandolf.

[Bennett]

Sounds like fun to me. I would say put them back in Splork, only it seems that the low risk / high return group xp is still not enough for some people.

If I fly off the handle, will you raise solo xp ?

[Gandolf]

Regardless its fixed, and either way, face it your gonna still lead, and so are whoever ends up leading in the future of this game... If you were leading in the first place we would have had more joiners and we wouldnt have cf'd in the first place

[Bennett]

[quote="jezer":28wdxt2a]
Desert xp is low risk?

Deaths last week...

Rogue 66
Godz 63
Scarlet 27
Dsfren 17
Stab 17
Tuk 14
Whiff 13
Paka 19
Chelle 17
Jex 17
Necro 16
Cozy 13
Nova 11
Poit 9
[/quote:28wdxt2a]

And most likely someone was right there to throw a raise on or grab their corpse. A count of the # shocks would be a lot more relevant if you want to make a statement about risk.

[jezer]

[quote="Bennett":3m8x74g2][quote="jezer":3m8x74g2]
Desert xp is low risk?

Deaths last week...

Rogue 66
Godz 63
Scarlet 27
Dsfren 17
Stab 17
Tuk 14
Whiff 13
Paka 19
Chelle 17
Jex 17
Necro 16
Cozy 13
Nova 11
Poit 9
[/quote:3m8x74g2]

And most likely someone was right there to throw a raise on or grab their corpse. A count of the # shocks would be a lot more relevant if you want to make a statement about risk.[/quote:3m8x74g2]

Ok, chat to whiff about today.

[Gimlet]

seriously, xp risk shouldn't be directly linked to the number of deaths.

stupidly run groups will result in 66 deaths a week even in kobolds


[quote="jezer":20w2gzcv][quote="Bennett":20w2gzcv][quote="jezer":20w2gzcv]
Desert xp is low risk?

Deaths last week...

Rogue 66
Godz 63
Scarlet 27
Dsfren 17
Stab 17
Tuk 14
Whiff 13
Paka 19
Chelle 17
Jex 17
Necro 16
Cozy 13
Nova 11
Poit 9
[/quote:20w2gzcv]

And most likely someone was right there to throw a raise on or grab their corpse. A count of the # shocks would be a lot more relevant if you want to make a statement about risk.[/quote:20w2gzcv]

Ok, chat to whiff about today.[/quote:20w2gzcv]

[*Chobbs*]

Mornin' folks,

Wow. Those death counts really are high. But let's really look at them for a sec. We'll take the top three and analyze them a bit instead of immediately taking everything out of context.

For simplicity's sake, let's say all these deaths were from desert and mystica. Let's assume the worse case scenario, and that each death was a shock, with enough exp to lose a prime level (40mil).

63 deaths 2.52 bil
66 deaths 2.64 bil
27 deaths 1.08 bil

Now let's take that from the exp that was gained.

5.667 bil - 2.52 bil = 3.147 bil
4.754 bil - 2.64 bil = 2.114 bil
2.049 bil - 1.08 bil = 969 mil

Looking at these figures, the top two deaths still have more exp than every other person below them save one (Tuk at 2.8bil). Third place still has an impressive gain with nearly a billion. Remember, this is assuming EVERY death ended in a shock/corpse, which I'm sure is exactly what happened last week.

Now let's look at some of those who did NOT die 60+ times, and do the same thing.
Toxis at 4.99bil - 11 deaths @40mil = 4.5 bil
Cizin at 4.05bil - 6 deaths @40mil = 3.80 bil
Tuk at 2.87bil - 14 deaths @40mil = 2.32 bil
Necro at 2.00bil - 16 deaths @40mil = 1.36 bil

Remember, this is assuming EVERY death resulted in a shock/corpse.

Wait, I'm sorry, what exactly are folks complaining about?

The exp gained in these two areas alone is absurd. Despite the daunting damage in desert, it's remarkably safe, largely due to the fact that, as Toxis says, it's been run 'one billion times'. Leaders know exactly what to expect, it just becomes automatic after a point. The groups that run there are enormous, almost quest size. To really screw up, you'd have to either really try, push the group to its absolute limit, or afk the entire time, all of which I'm sure is the imms fault.

Folks die, they get raised or shocked, they log back in, some gripe, others don't, Sloth moves on. If there's a CF, folks go and get the corpses back, or someone staffs, and raise exp aplenty for clerics.

I'm sure if I chat with whiff or 95% of the other folks who have shocked or corpsed, some might gripe for a bit, but all just pick themselves up and move on. At that exp rate in desert and mystica, the experience will be recouped in an hour or two, tops. Even the folks here eventually collected themselves, which is good.

So please, instead of immediately lashing out, please just take a second and take a deep breath, relax, step away from the screen for a sec and then just ask someone. Imms are more inclined to listen and help if it's a real discussion instead of a tirade against how evil/stupid/bad they are. I mean, how would you react if the imms publicly decry players for ruining the mud and calling them 'retarded, ruining areas, &c'. Remember, we're still people too.

Chobbs!

[Gandolf]

[quote:1wlwbxai]Leaders know exactly what to expect, it just becomes automatic after a point. The groups that run there are enormous, almost quest size. To really screw up, you'd have to either really try, push the group to its absolute limit[/quote:1wlwbxai]

Now this would have been a correct statement, however the group that was running was not epic size nor was it a very *quick moving* desert swiping group, it was a small group, with 3 front liners, and maybe 8 back liners, if that... So yes, if it had been one of those so called quest size group, I would have been fine... However it wasn't we had just a couple mages a couple clerics 2-3 thieves and 1 front line warrior or so... We had died to the bloated mobs of aged Exp a few times starting the run, typical, first run is always the worst... I definately didn't need the help of 2 charging mobs that have never charged in any version of sloth

[jezer]

If Chobbs argument was supposed to prove Desert and Mystica are not risky xp in the context of group xp on sloth... what is risky group xp on sloth? And if it existed who would do it anyway? We just whined about the changes to desert?

I was getting 800k for a stone giant in that group, so it wasn't really great xp either (yesterdays group was better), although I am grateful for any group xp which is generally 3x higher than solo per time spent.

We need extraordinary amounts of xp to get stronger in this new game... if you seriously think that making this journey harder is going to impress us, grow a brain.

Do you really think this "oh but it's too easy, lets chuck in crazy stuff to chuck them out" wins us over? Do you really think you do these changes for a greater good? Are not the players the reason for the game?! do ya think we are going to jump around and say, hey! this is too easy, ethically I am now going to solo kobolds to earn my way there? If we thought this way, we wouldn't run desert would we! We want there and we want there fast. What you did was such a stupid change, it was only going to get us once... and we would change tactics for the next time.

So grouping and xp was too good in your opinion, and all the imms can come up with as a think tank is to make two mobs charge and catch us out once?!? It's that kind of stupidity that really annoys me as a player. It makes me realize I am going to be very disappointed if i let myself get attached too much to this game. It was completely small minded. No better than tripping up a baby. Satisfied? Justified?

You've got an xp mess in this game, and a gazillion bandaids to try and make it workable, you can't fix that crap doing stuff like this. Fix the area's, they have always been your problem. Xp is too centered around "perceived risk" than good old hitpoints and damage. Some mobs pay 10 times more and have less hitpoints, that's just stupid, esp when not everyone is a thief. Small minds!

Do you think deleting my posts all the time Splork makes the problem go away?

[*Splork*]

Ill delete any post that insults or degrades the Immortals, including me on these forums.

We are not going to sit up here and take personal attacks and name calling. For those who insist on continuing to post posts like the one I removed will simply be removed from the forums and if it continues from the game itself. We are individuals and the changes we make are not personal. Some of the changes work out and some do not.

Feel free to post constructive criticism but we are not going to tolerate personal attacks.

Splork

[Thraxas]

You gotta love slothmud sometimes, and this thread is symptomatic of why.

The game is working, player numbers are growing, players are progressing, players are enjoying playing the game. Imms are imming and making changes and develoiping and we're all happy.

Then an imm makes a single change it has an unexpected outcome and all hell is set loose, despite the change being removed swiftly hell continues to send eddies onto the forum and swirl discontent through the online ether. Never mind the hundred or so changes that imm has made over the past month that have been good balancing or benefical, never mind the fargates godlites and scatters the same imm has spread round, never mind the time and dedication he (along with the rest of the imm team) has put into making this one of the best administered muds I've seen in the last 20+years of mudding. No we gotta have one single change kicking off and maintaining this quite frankly stupid and over the top thread.

I wish you'd all just get a sense of perspective, calm down and do what you're here to do enjoy playing or running a game.

There are a lot of good players here, and a lot of good imms, most the time we work together well this sort of thread is just quite frankly unhelpful.

T