Poisons

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Poisons

Postby Shadis » Fri May 28, 2004 9:27 am

Well its just not a thief section without me posting

One suggestion on poisons

iocaine is used because it is sold
all the others are not

suggestion
remove all the other posions, leave just iocaine but call it just poison
if poison is applied by itself
apply poison dagger
it is reg poison
but for each other poison ..say percodan
apply poison dagger percodan (you must have white powder in inv)
your poison is applied as percodan

each poison has its unique item
cork
pepper
powder
wand
mesh

use them in this manor

i think the whole brew thing has failed, almost no one brew poisons any more

Just an idea
*All opinions posted here are entirely mine and thus are worth less then the 1's and 0's they are typed with!*
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Brews

Postby Ender » Tue Jul 06, 2004 5:17 pm

I think the major reason no one wants to brew poisons is because of the cost involved for a couple of doses. If brewed poisons were significantly stronger, or even had the possibility to a one hit kill, they might be more attractive.

I agree with Shadis here, this is currently in the too hard to do category because the benefit just isn't there. I think another tactic I saw in the equipment section is a far better idea. I believe it was a spider dagger? After completing a quest, getting some items and paying some gold, it could be forged into a BETTER spider dagger.

I think your better solution would be to create a way to allow you to add permanent poison procs to stabbing weapons, or even long duration temporary procs that leave you back your original weapon.

If all that's too complicated, perhaps you could just increase the numbers of applies you get from a vial of poison...
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Postby Methyx » Tue Dec 28, 2004 1:01 am

Being limited on mana, I find myself looking more closely at adding new poisons to my attack strategy. I am particularly interested in the Macedon and Spirit Seeker poisons.

There is no price for brewing listed under the Macedon. Does anyone know the cost?

For the Spirit Seeker, I have found most of the items, but I don't know where or how to obtain a cork or the Necronomicon. Are these items still in game, and where can I find them if they are?

Once you have all the ingredients, what is the process for brewing? Do you go to a local alchemist with CP's and gold in hand and type "Brew <poison name>?

And finally, the last two posts on the use of poisons were rather pessimistic. Are there any thieves out there who have had good luck with poisons, or do the costs really outweigh the benefits?

Thanks in advance for any input you can provide :)

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Postby Alberich » Tue Dec 28, 2004 9:00 am

i would not be able to solo well at all with my th/ma without poisons - at +13 dam, +23 stabdam, with poisons, I can splork 2 mil+ mobs - take away the iocaines, and what i can splork on stab drops to at most around 500-600k mobs... so basically, by not being cheap, and willing to spend a few k gold, I can do around 10-11mils xp solo at low tri40 (and could do at 2x40, for that matter) as supposed to around 3-4mils xp solo.. i do think it is moderatly ridiculous how high the failed apply rate is, and having a prime ability that can damage you sucks, but for me at least, the benefits so far outweigh the costs i would not consider doing it any other way.
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Postby 12345 » Tue Dec 28, 2004 10:34 am

Considering the rate I go through iocaine, and the number of times I see 'You think it looks right.', poison myself or double whiff, I'm not convinced that the other poisons are worth the cycling time unless I was trying to forge a scarab of destruction.

As for iocaine, as a 2x40 running +13 damage, I wouldn't consider running without it. However, between the cost of poison and continually buying back lost levels, it can be an expensive way to play.
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Postby Deju » Tue Dec 28, 2004 11:24 am

As a thief prime, I can say that i feel that using iocaine is pretty much the only way to solo, even though i feel that a prime skill that REQUIRES that you spend gold is annoying.

That said, I never use any of the other brewed poisons. The time required to collect and brew them is not worth it to me. Consider a classic thief style mob. Decent xp, hits like a truck, but is rather crunchy. Would you want to blind this mob instead of using iocaine to eliminate 1-2 rounds of combat?

As far as the spirit seeker is concerned: the cork pops in the trog bar, but i dont think anyone has found where the necronomicon pops yet. However, this potion isnt quite as cool as it sounds. It doesnt let your stab hurt ethereal mobs, it just causes a small amount of damage from the poison proc.... i found that it wasnt super helpful.

Of course, thats just my opinion. I could be wrong.
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Postby Medios » Tue Dec 28, 2004 5:22 pm

I use iocaine every time I stab. The extra damage it does keeps me from getting hit or having to use mana. The 5k cost isnt a factor since I can kill several more mobs and recoup the coins. The brewed poisons I tested and do not use. Spending time to collect components, brew, and fail to apply 3-4 times for one good application isnt worth the time or effort. Spirit Seeker is really more of a pain than anything, I can usually get 2 winds off on an ether mob before it attacks, or i can brew the poison and get the silly proc and maybe one wind if im lucky. The concentrated iocaine is pretty cool but a pain to brew. The other poisons as someone else mentioned arent worth messing with to get a blind, or silence a mob. Most mobs that cast have procs that silence doesnt affect anyways.

Basically store bought poison is super cool, rest are lame and a waste of time.

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Postby Methyx » Tue Dec 28, 2004 9:26 pm

It looks like I'll just have to focus on getting up to the 2x40 mark so I can hound some better eq, get a better stabber, work on increasing my total dam bonus (+11 is pretty lousy for a Thief Prime I hear), and keep plenty of Iocain handy :)

Thanks for all the information and advice guys. I really appreciate it.

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Postby Teron » Mon Jan 05, 2009 2:29 pm

Has anyone since 2004 used poisons, other than iocaine, for stabs?

I have tried macedon (blind) and it is nice on large mobs that hit hard.

As mentioned, spirit seeker is junk. It simply doesn't give me a chance to start with a blast.

I still haven't figured out what other poisons do, I guess I should brew them.
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Postby Rynquald » Mon Jan 05, 2009 7:58 pm

I carry and use a small assortment of poisons on Chrome.

As you say, macedon is decent for mobs that you really want a blind on.

Prodex lands a dispel. It's not bad for mobs that keep up hermetic resonance, or just ensuring that the dispel comes before other people's blasting on a thick, resisting stab mob (admittedly, I don't use it in stab groups much, but there's been occasion).

Ryodine is slow if I remember right. Not bad on mobs with few attacks.

I'm yet to try percodan, but the poisons help file makes it sound like weaken. Might be useful.

Of course spiritseeker is laughably useless.
Be quiet or i'll stab you quiet -BM
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Postby Autolycos » Mon Jan 05, 2009 8:50 pm

[quote="Rynquald":5wxxiwc6]I carry and use a small assortment of poisons on Chrome..[/quote:5wxxiwc6]

as do i, well rounded bag of tricks ;)

[quote="Rynquald":5wxxiwc6]Of course spiritseeker is laughably useless.[/quote:5wxxiwc6]

Indeed... almost as useless as Brad :)
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Postby Rynquald » Mon Jan 05, 2009 10:39 pm

[quote="Autolycos":25u6kq5g]as do i, well rounded bag of tricks Wink[/quote:25u6kq5g]

Exactly, what's a thief to do without trickery? :)
Be quiet or i'll stab you quiet -BM
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Postby Teron » Thu Jan 08, 2009 4:57 am

A few days ago I tried Spirit Seeker on a ghost maid: got her to qaf.

I am thinking: maybe its dam is based on mobs total HP? Then stabbing larger mobs might be helpful.

Also, I have an idea: poisons, except iocaine, are meant to be used in groups: after all, Jake wants to make this mud group-oriented.

Technically, I'd also enjoy poisons to be used in solo. Or at least the same poisons, which I can buy in a shop in some remote area, because, really, brewing them is a pain.

Thanks.
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Postby Rynquald » Thu Jan 08, 2009 5:52 am

I've used spiritseeker on a couple of good group-sized ethers and taken them to scratches. I'm more inclined to believe that you just get a generic damage proc.

Also, obtaining poisons takes pretty much no effort at all, as long as you know you want them so can keep an eye out for them. Most of the cps are the kind of junk people just drop on the ground. And running stab xp on lyme will normally yield a handful of vials.
Be quiet or i'll stab you quiet -BM
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Postby Teron » Thu Jan 08, 2009 10:48 am

There are 5 brewed poisons, 3-5 cps for each, which means you might as well be carrying 20-30 items before brewing a single poison.

While it might be a good idea to keep the cps, it's just a hassle. Then again, one might buy them from the shops. Still a neusance =)

And yes, I vaguely remembered stabbing flamewraith to scratches :) Unfortunately, I don't remember, if blind poison works on an ether mob.
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